Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hello, everybody, and welcome to the Integrated Home, the podcast that's produced by the home integration community for the home integration community.
My name is Geoff Hayward and today we're at Alexander House, the home of AWE in Epsom, and we're here to find out more about the brand Optoma and its range of innovations for smart home integrators. Welcome to the Integrated Home.
So I'm delighted to be joined by Stuart Tickle, Managing Director of AWE. And also I've got James Fitzgerald and Ben Brown of Optoma with me today for this discussion. Welcome all to the show.
[00:00:34] Speaker B: Hi, Jeff. Thank you.
[00:00:36] Speaker A: So, before we begin, can you give me a brief introduction into you and your backgrounds? Let's go with Ben.
[00:00:43] Speaker C: Hello, Jeff. Yes. So, Ben Brown, I'm the head of UK and I Optima. I've been in the AV industry for nearly 30 years actually now, starting many years ago as an AV designer at Miscco, but my career has taken me to Samsung, Hewlett Packard, more recently with Promethean and took over Optum about three and a half years ago now.
[00:01:08] Speaker A: Fantastic. Then, Stuart, you're the man in the middle, so you go next.
[00:01:11] Speaker B: Yes. Stuart Tickle, MD, of Awe.
Probably the easiest way of doing the last 90 years is for people to go and look at the 90 years in 90 minutes video, which in fact Wildwood did for US company last year. Yeah, superb. Highly recommend them.
But really my last 35 plus years is entirely within what was retail. Hi Fi. And then last 25 years plus is focusing on specialist distribution to the custom
[00:01:43] Speaker A: install community, which is why we're here today. What about you, James? What's your background?
[00:01:47] Speaker D: Yeah, so I've been working in the AV industry and working for Optima for 20 years. It's my 20th year in October, working with a number of customers. Pretty much started off with the B2B area of the business and then moved over about 10 years ago to retail and more recently into the home market. I'm the sales manager for the home market as well, so I look after all the lovely bigger retailers as well as the Cedia customers and the home customers as well.
[00:02:12] Speaker A: Fantastic. I think it'd be fair to say that Optimus is having a bit of a moment in the CI world. Who's. Forgive me, a brief introduction into where the brands come from.
[00:02:21] Speaker D: So Optima was formed 2002, subsidiary of Kortronic.
Kotronic manufactured and they brought to market. First of all, the first product was a 65 inch projector television.
But they've been innovative and they've Always been at the forefront of bringing out new technologies to the market.
More notably back in 2005 they had an all in one projector, so a DVD loaded projector which was at the time very innovative.
2008 they were the first to market a portable handheld projector.
2016 as well, we were actually the first to market the 4K laser project, Ultra short throw laser projectors as well.
So, you know, and also we were very heavy, heavily invested into the 3D projection revolution as well. So Optima have got a very long heritage of being kind of the first to market on a number of different areas.
[00:03:15] Speaker A: Certainly have. And I guess that heritage, Stuart, was part of the attraction for bringing Optuma into the AWE portfolio. Do you want to talk a bit more about the thinking behind that decision and why it was the right time for you to make this partnership?
[00:03:29] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely.
Optima obviously incredibly strong brand and you see how markets change and I think it'd be fair to say, Ben, there's quite a lot of turbulence around in the markets at the time, including in the distribution side of things. So we first spoke to Optuma probably six months before we got things together and initially you're just kicking tires. But what really struck me is how wide the portfolio was, how the depth of the products and expertise and that's inside projection as well as outside with the large format displays and so on.
So you know, we're obviously, you know, very well known, extremely well known for our expertise in the custom install industry. So there was an interest from Optumr on that part as they were going higher end from where they'd traditionally been in the market and coming into more the home cinema side, but with a different take on it from our other brands in the portfolio. It was really important to us that there was a unique story to tell.
I'm sure we'll come on to that technology in a bit.
But it was also within projection there was a very good range of products that we could utilise our expertise with our retail market as well. So supplying some key retailers.
And then as I say outside there was this whole portfolio, the whole world of products with large format displays coming at a different angle from our other partners, talking about the quality and quantity from a more price aggressive end, but still retaining aiming with premium quality as the end result.
[00:05:21] Speaker A: Does that sum it all up really well, Ben?
[00:05:23] Speaker C: Yeah, I think it really does. I think that the whole of the industry saw there's been some real challenge in distribution over the last couple of years and I think we can see that really Ended with the demise of Exertis. And I think we were really looking for someone who could help us step into the CDM market. Had a really strong brand there and Awe definitely have that. They've really allowed us to be able to bring our newer products to market and they really helped us position them correctly into that market as well. And I think it definitely feels that that was the right time for us to partner with awe. But even moving forward, I think we're continuing to see the strengthening of the partnership as we look at that CD business. But actually as we really are starting to look at expanding what we do together.
[00:06:15] Speaker A: Now. Optoma describes itself as a leader in 4K, UHD and DLP projection.
What would you say makes the brand particularly relevant to the luxury residential space?
[00:06:26] Speaker D: Yeah, optima for over 10 years have been kind of number one or two in the projection market or based on volume of projectors sold. We've sold thousands of projectors through the likes of Amazon and Currys More in the entry level space. And when we brought out the bigger, more flagship models like the UHS 68 LV and the more recent flagship UHS 78 LV, we knew that that was they, they were a great fit for the residential smart home market, you know, with all the different features that they have and they offer the real home cinema customer a really good option.
[00:06:59] Speaker A: And Stuart, you talked about the breadth of portfolio that made Optimo really attractive for you. Do you want to just pull out some of the things that really caught your eye?
[00:07:07] Speaker B: The range suits our model very well because channel management and working across custom install and retail.
And then with Optuma's more original mainstream online business, we were able to work very closely because of the depth of the range and work out right which models are best positioned for which channels and then work with Optuma to handle that. And that's really important because the brand has to be fully on board with a market strategy.
I think the thing that broadline dis do well is shift volume to whoever wants to buy it.
And that's not a game that we're in.
We all want volume, but it needs to be done with. The more premium the products get, the more strategy and expertise and support is needed behind it.
So I think it was that combination of having a portfolio that meant we could address some areas of volume market, but again through independent retailers that still need handholding and expert advice and support and system specification screens and all that full package through to positioning.
Why would you buy an Optoma projector for a premium installation and There are reasons all brands have their strengths and Optimote was quite clear with their technology.
It's really the.
I don't want to narrow it down to cost per lumen, but actually if you look at it, the lumens have become a much more important part of a good projection system than it used to be. Obviously with HDR and bigger screens becoming a factor needing to compete with bigger TVs, so lumens become important Optima's. One of Optima's particular strengths is the color accuracy within a high brightness at a keen price point.
So, you know, we saw at the higher end some reasons for Optoma to fit well within custom install.
But with the depth of product line that meant we could also get some volume from some quality, but more mainstream cinema products.
[00:09:28] Speaker A: So it really filled quite a sizable gap in the market for you in terms of all those areas that they could cover for you.
[00:09:35] Speaker B: Yeah, there would have been no point. It would have been foolish for us to take on any brand that just goes head to head product per product with no USPs. That's, you know, our job is to represent brands to their best.
And if you're just fighting more products of the same category head to head, then actually, which product do we sell and why and which product do we speak to? Integrators. Whereas with Optima it was quite clear that there were USPs that were brought to the table that differentiated from the other brands in the market.
And that was really important part of, you know, because we can sit here strategically working out how to position Optima in the market whilst making sure we do our job for the integrators, which is to recommend the right product for the right install.
[00:10:34] Speaker A: Of course,
[00:10:37] Speaker C: yeah, I couldn't agree more. And I think what's been great, if we look at the last 12 months, we've been able to show the integrators and the installers our LED exchangeable lens products, flat panel products as well as projection. But I think we're absolutely right that there was no point in Optuma bringing products to market that were going to directly compete against the people who had been in that market for a considerable amount of time. And I think actually what Optuma are really great at, which James kind of talked about earlier, was actually the different user cases in different spaces. So where we're looking at people that maybe don't have space for their own home cinema room, but want to be able to have a cinema experience, maybe on a Saturday night watching a film with their family, but they want that space to obviously be used as a family space as well on the Sunday. Maybe they have friends around and want to watch the football because of the extra looms that we're able to offer. It means you can have that cinema experience on the Saturday night, but have it used as a general room on a Sunday, but still be able to use the projector to be able to deliver an audio visual experience. And I think the different uses of rooms and different user cases really allows Optuma to take their products and to position them potentially where it's somewhere that's not as traditional as it has been in the past. And kind of, as we said before, there's no point us just trying to go and battle on exactly the same thing on the specs and just try and hit that. Actually, let's go and find something that's a little bit different. Find something where we think we can really bring some value to the market.
And that's what we've tried to do. As James said with the 68 and the 78 we've released.
[00:12:27] Speaker A: So the features and benefits allow you to move beyond home cinema into those more media rooms or multipurpose spaces and be something more than just a projector. You're actually enabling people to live and enjoy entertainment wherever they might be in the home.
[00:12:41] Speaker D: Yeah, that's correct. Yeah. I mean, 5,000 lumens does give you that diverse, really diverse.
[00:12:47] Speaker A: That's pretty good. The cost per lumen thing as well is attractive with that too.
[00:12:51] Speaker D: Yeah, exactly. And that's on the 68 and the 78 LV. You've got so many other features, you know, HDR10 plus, Dolby Vision, you know, you name it. The 78 especially is packed and it's triple RGB, triple laser as well. So it's very, very good color output.
[00:13:07] Speaker A: And I recognize that we are talking all about this on an audio only podcast, but you can actually see this for yourself if you come to Alexander House. You've got the demo facility set up here, Stuart, under Banjon.
[00:13:18] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. We've got all the key units on display.
But if there's a demo requirement for a particular product and it's not on display, then that can usually be organized in advance as well.
But the key things are when would you specify an Optoma projector? And we can look at and support an integrator to identify which products are right for which install. And coming back to that point is about the differentiation over other products.
There's no point.
We have a strong portfolio.
But it means Integrators that come to awe are going to be sure they're going to end up with the best product for that install, which is entirely different to going to a company that just has one product, because there's no way that one product can do every or that one range can fill every gap.
There is a reason why the high lumens is a thing right now.
HDR has been around for a long time, but you haven't really been able to squeeze out true color light output, high lumens at a sensible price point. It's always been quite big, heavy units. To get 5,000 lumen upwards, you can get data projectors that chuck out as much light as you want, but they don't have the cinematic quality and the color balance. And actually the color light output is sometimes with color wheels and so on, you've got a white section in there and the lumen output you're getting is measured on the white, which is completely different. You get about a third of that maybe in color light output on moving images.
One of the things with the premium Optima is with the triple laser system is that with many DLP projectors of an age or, or a type, and with lesser technology, you still get things like the rainbow effect and others, whereas actually Optimus technology means that's virtually eliminated.
So you get the benefits without some of the drawbacks of that particular technology.
[00:15:44] Speaker A: One other thing that's really impressed me is that you're getting that lumen output. But the size and the quietness of the Optoma projectors, I mean, massive things. If you want to be in a cinema room watching something, you don't want to be distracted by a huge whirring fan. You don't have that, do you?
[00:15:59] Speaker B: It's quiet, yeah.
[00:16:01] Speaker C: I mean, technology is constantly moving forward. And I think, as I say, obviously being part of the Kortronic group, those developments are being worked on constantly.
And that's why Optuma is so often first to market with those improvements, because we are part of that business and so other people often will follow with those. But we're very often the first to market and we're always trying to drive improvements and build products are moving projection forward.
[00:16:32] Speaker A: At ise, I was impressed to see an Optoma projector that was designed for swimming pool installation. I'm not sure I've ever seen that before, but do you want to talk about that and maybe some of the other niche applications that for the wild and wacky installations out there might be suitable too?
[00:16:50] Speaker C: Absolutely. So, yeah, so Poulom Actually came to us about four or five years ago now and we're looking to do underwater projection.
A lot of people have projected through water before, but as soon as the surface is broken, that ruins the image that is projected through. So they wanted the projector to be under the water.
So we obviously took that back to Core Tronic and said, look, how can we make this happen?
And the biggest challenge was going to be cooling. However, when you're going to be putting a projector underwater, actually water is pretty good coolant and interestingly enough, actually the water cooling is more stable than air cooling is outside of Ward. So the cooling method actually work better than if you're having to use air coolant. So we managed to develop that projector and now it's starting to see some traction and some usage. But that's just one example of what we do. I mean, a lot of time people come to us and they don't want a projector, they want the engine from the inside. They just want to be able to project images using the products that they're developing. We work with a number of companies about those customization projects and even things like the sim markets. Gulf Sim has been absolutely key for our business, but also Dart, so a company called 501, they just needed the projector to be turned on and be set up exactly how their installers needed it. So we did that firmware for them, arranged it for them, so every projector they bought, they turned it on, it had the 501 firmware on it, and every projector was set up exactly as they wanted it for the install. So where people are looking for some customization to one, make their product better or suit their user case, or actually make it a lot easier for people to be able to use it, we're always open to having those conversations again. Being part of the Kortronic group really allows us to be able to influence and to work with that business on exactly what people want from their projection.
[00:18:49] Speaker A: I mean, that goes back to that whole doing something for the use case for. For what the client wants. So it sounds like you've got a good partnership going with Optuma, where you can present them with challenges and they can say, yeah, we can help.
[00:19:03] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. And the vast majority of sales are always going to come from the bread and butter, the things that we do day in, day out.
Well, but there are all sorts of applications.
One of the good things about Optuma is that whilst it's got this massive backing of Cortronic and Optuma itself is Decent size to say the least. The team we work with, Ben and James and the tech support is a comparatively smaller independent unit. So we can actually have conversations with the people that can do stuff, get yeses or nos. So I think it's realistic to frame it.
Some of the projectors that go into things like the Darts one, the individual projector is quite inexpensive.
So that's just a projector that has a particular set of features that sets its stall out to be good at what it does. And that isn't necessarily the same product that's going to be the right one for a home cinema.
But that brings project opportunities to us because obviously a lot of our integrators, whilst they might be doing individual high end rooms, actually there's a far huge application for light commercial and other applications. And that's where it's interesting because we are seeing more products from commercial coming into resi and vice versa. You know, there's that gray area in the middle which is very interesting.
[00:20:30] Speaker A: I agree. It feels like we talk about immersive environments. So it doesn't really matter whether it's in the home or outside the home in a hospitality space.
[00:20:38] Speaker B: Yeah. Because again, it's right product for the application. So if you're talking about a racing sim, you need incredibly fast refresh rates. You need potentially to be able to set up the projectors for edge blending. If you're putting three of them side by side for golf, that's more likely to be a single unit. But you need a particular throw ratio and lens shift to be able to make sure you don't hit the thing with your golf club as you're swimming.
[00:21:06] Speaker A: Indeed.
[00:21:08] Speaker B: Which is a different application from that multipurpose media room, living room. You know, is it a permanent install or is it a bring it out of the family room where it's permanently installed. But actually is it something you need that you're gonna. For the World cup or for the, for the, you know, even you could say for the sporting events you're going to put on to put onto a bigger screen somewhere else because you're going to have a more entertainment space.
So the application for projection is free, far wider than it was. We're way past the days of, you know, big units being sat in one place in one room that is dedicated. Because in those days, and I'm going back, you know, 15 plus years, you, you didn't have the lumens to do anything else with it. You needed a big unit to give you a great cinema and you can
[00:22:02] Speaker A: access all These products through awe.
[00:22:05] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:22:06] Speaker A: And that goes for all the commercial products that you do that might be suitable for those commercial applications that Stuart's talking about as well.
[00:22:14] Speaker D: Absolutely, yeah. And also to help support a lot of the commercial installations or if there's anything bespoke, we have great technical support. You know, we have a guy, Mike Diaz, who's external technical support. He can go on site.
It's absolutely free support as well for customers to help with their support. There's and he's hands on. He'll go and go to the customer sites and find out about measurements. He'd be able to do CAD drawings for them to help with any bespoke installations. Anything a bit more difficult to install.
[00:22:51] Speaker B: We've shown the edge blending and also the mapping products here and those, I look at those now. We had the Baz and Wilkins Nautilus speaker and Mike set up a projector with a big wall of immersive background and then mapped a particular.
Well, the Nautilus image which just made it pop.
It just makes your mind think this is interior design as much as it is. Yeah.
[00:23:25] Speaker A: It's opening up the mind, isn't it? To I could use that or that could be a really cool solution in somewhere else. Yeah.
[00:23:32] Speaker D: To help with that as well, we've also got, you know, a great opportunity with the products outside of that. I mean we have fixed lens and short throw projectors going up in 4K, going up UHD going up to 8,8500 lumens.
We have exchangeable lens up to 13,500 lumens.
[00:23:47] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:23:47] Speaker D: In 4K, you know, and there's 10 different lens options. So you can go with a throw ratio of 0.34 all the way up to 8.6 should you want to with the exchangeable lens. So, you know, there's a big scope of installation possibilities.
[00:24:01] Speaker C: Yeah, I think that's really interesting. I think what Ann James have just talked about is flexibility.
And I think one of the things that we really do because of the breadth of our range in projection, but also other products. When you want to make a digital image big and you need to make it fit a space, there is going to be an optimal solution that will allow you to do that. And I think the flexibility of our portfolio really does set us apart from the other AV who have real strengths in certain areas and definitely do. But the flexibility of our portfolio really allows you to be able to say look, we want to do this.
And normally Optima along with Adobe will be able to say, well we'll find a solution for that.
[00:24:44] Speaker B: That's a great reminder Ben, because a projector isn't always the right solution either.
So it's the large format display and how it's used. And again coming back to that digital canvas idea, which could be used for anything. It could be used for teams meets, it could be used as a home cinema display, it could be used just as ambient background could be users information.
So what environment it's going into and what the use case is, it's what is it projection or is it large format display? And then that narrows it down to which of those is most appropriate for that environment.
[00:25:22] Speaker A: Presumably with Kortronics backing of Optima, a substantial brand that you're dealing with that's going to support you and the industry.
[00:25:30] Speaker B: Yeah, it's the communication supply chains have been very difficult at different times with different brands and there are reasons why that happens.
Optuma has been a strong partner giving us visibility of timelines and so on. And obviously we do stockholding of all core products anyway, as you'd expect.
But it starts. It's not often these projects, the more tricky projects that perhaps aren't sitting on our shelf generally are scheduled. They're a project that's happening and that's where we can work with Optima with timelines and we give pipeline availability even from the point where we register a project.
So like I say, if it's a normal projector that somebody seen, they've brought a client here and they've done a demo, they've specified an Optoma and of course that's very likely to be sitting on our shelf. If it's not, then it's about, well, what's that timeline? And we have good communication from Optuma on that.
Those more tricky things, like I say, they're project based. We will register that with Optima Pipeline. If it's a particularly unusual thing, you know, Mike Diaz for example, as James referred to, is probably involved. If it's a more complicated thing and then we get visibility and we'll work with it.
[00:26:48] Speaker A: Yeah, okay, so if we're sitting here again in two years time, what does success look like for this awe Optima partnership?
[00:26:56] Speaker B: Still? Yeah, still sitting around the table.
[00:26:58] Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly.
[00:27:00] Speaker B: Hopefully we'll have done something we were left in between.
[00:27:03] Speaker C: Yeah, exactly.
[00:27:03] Speaker B: That's a long time.
[00:27:04] Speaker C: Definitely, definitely been sat here and look, I think the continued partnership because I think that's what it really has brought over the last three years. And obviously with all of these things there's challenges, but Stuart said It exactly right. The communication is absolutely needed if you're going to make these things work. And I think we have really great communication between us. I think us continuing to establish ourselves with these Cedia products coming through. But actually some of the other products we talked about, we're really looking forward and excited to do some projects with awe that help us and them expand into maybe markets that we weren't in before. So for me it's going to be about that continued growth with awe. And yeah, the communication that means we can all sit around the table, Stuart.
[00:27:59] Speaker A: Still be friends.
[00:27:59] Speaker C: Exactly that.
[00:28:01] Speaker A: What about you, James? What's your ambition?
[00:28:03] Speaker D: Yeah, absolutely the same as I say, it's working together, working, build the partnership, build the customer, breadth of customer, you know, and also introduce bigger products as Optuma develops with more products, but introducing them to awe and also making sure that, you know, with both of our combined expertise, we can educate and help the market grow as well.
[00:28:26] Speaker A: And it would be unfair of me, Stuart, to host this podcast recording here without giving you the opportunity for a call to action. So what would you like the audience to do to find out more?
[00:28:37] Speaker B: Well, we just invested a huge amount into various upgrades at the show apartment here at Epsom HQ and that's going to continue.
So of course we are very happy to come to dealers, to integrators and visit, but it's well worth booking a visit here to awe, which means you can see the products in person in the environment where they're going to shine.
Very good. So I would say book a visit here, but if you want us to come to you and that can be with a product, if you'd rather we came on site to you to show you then also. That's good. So getting face to face with people.
[00:29:20] Speaker A: Get the experience face to face. There you go. You heard it, people. Thank you very much, James. Thanks, Ben. And thanks Stuart for sharing your insight with us today. You can find out more about the Integrated Home on our social channels ntegratedhome podcast. The Integrated Home is a Wildwood plus production and we support together for cinema.
